https://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/api.php?action=feedcontributions&user=Victor+Porton&feedformat=atomNew Testament wiki - User contributions [en]2024-03-28T16:11:07ZUser contributionsMediaWiki 1.31.2https://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Sitenotice&diff=41MediaWiki:Sitenotice2019-04-28T16:34:14Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>Let's collect all interpretations of New Testament. '''[https://gogetfunding.com/bible-study-without-vowels-project/ Donate]''' <div style="float:right"><addthis /></div></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Sitenotice&diff=40MediaWiki:Sitenotice2019-04-19T21:06:54Z<p>Victor Porton: Undo revision 39 by Victor Porton (talk)</p>
<hr />
<div>Let's collect all interpretations of New Testament <div style="float:right"><addthis /></div></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Sitenotice&diff=39MediaWiki:Sitenotice2019-04-19T21:03:14Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>Let's collect all interpretations of New Testament <div style="float:right"></div></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Common.css&diff=38MediaWiki:Common.css2016-07-19T18:45:21Z<p>Victor Porton: Created page with "/* CSS placed here will be applied to all skins */ .google_plusone_iframe_widget { width: 25px !important; }"</p>
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<div>/* CSS placed here will be applied to all skins */<br />
<br />
.google_plusone_iframe_widget { width: 25px !important; }</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Sitenotice&diff=37MediaWiki:Sitenotice2016-06-09T20:15:59Z<p>Victor Porton: Created page with "Let's collect all interpretations of New Testament <div style="float:right"><addthis /></div>"</p>
<hr />
<div>Let's collect all interpretations of New Testament <div style="float:right"><addthis /></div></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Main_Page&diff=36Main Page2016-06-09T18:22:35Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>==Purpose of this site==<br />
<br />
This site is a wiki where we want to collect '''all''' interpretations and translations of New Testament (well, not all translations but all meanings).<br />
<br />
Please [[Special:UserLogin|signup]] and edit this site. You can put any kinds of commentaries on New Testament at this site, provided only that you don't violate copyright laws. Your edits will be moderated to protect from spam.<br />
<br />
==Biblical topics==<br />
<br />
Read and write any commentaries on New Testament topics:<br />
<br />
* [[Purpose_of_Jesus'_death|Purpose of Jesus' death]]<br />
<br />
==Rules==<br />
<br />
Rules for the site are not yet written. Please write rules proposal and discuss rules. Specifically we need to decide whether only "conventional" Christian views are allowed on this site, or will we allow all kinds of opinions.<br />
<br />
==Useful internal links==<br />
<br />
* [[Books|Books about New Testament]]<br />
<br />
==External links==<br />
<br />
* [https://withoutvowels.org Wiki site for Old Testament study]</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Blog:Main/The_purpose_of_Christ%27s_death&diff=35Blog:Main/The purpose of Christ's death2016-06-08T18:30:48Z<p>Victor Porton: Created page with "Victor Porton proposed a new theory of the purpose of Jesus' death. Accordingly this theory, Jesus died to show (especially to heavenly beings) that al..."</p>
<hr />
<div>[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton]] proposed a new theory of the purpose of Jesus' death.<br />
<br />
Accordingly this theory, Jesus died to show (especially to heavenly beings) that altruism will be rewarded even if it seems that it leads to death. This way Christ pulled them to his side of the cosmic battle and thus won it.<br />
<br />
[[Purpose_of_Jesus'_death|Read more and discuss about the purpose of Jesus' death]] in [https://newtestamentwiki.org/ New Testament wiki].<br />
{{wl-publish: 2016-06-08 18:30:48 +0000 | Victor Porton }}</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Blog:Main&diff=34Blog:Main2016-06-08T18:27:25Z<p>Victor Porton: Created page with "This is a blog of New Testament study."</p>
<hr />
<div>This is a blog of New Testament study.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Sidebar&diff=33MediaWiki:Sidebar2016-06-08T18:26:47Z<p>Victor Porton: Created page with " * navigation ** mainpage|mainpage-description ** Blog:Main|Blog ** recentchanges-url|recentchanges ** randompage-url|randompage ** helppage|help * SEARCH * TOOLBOX * LANGUAGES"</p>
<hr />
<div><br />
* navigation<br />
** mainpage|mainpage-description<br />
** Blog:Main|Blog<br />
** recentchanges-url|recentchanges<br />
** randompage-url|randompage<br />
** helppage|help<br />
* SEARCH<br />
* TOOLBOX<br />
* LANGUAGES</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=32Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T18:14:18Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Relation with other theories */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article<ref name=":0" />, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
=== Relation with other theories ===<br />
See a list of theological theories in <ref name=":0" />.<br />
* Ransom - the relation is unclear<br />
* Christus Victor - Victor Porton's theory is a special case of this theory<br />
* Moral exemplar - Victor Porton's theory is similar to this but the "exemplar" being for heavenly being rather then people<br />
* Satisfaction - the relation is unclear<br />
* Penal substitution - the relation is unclear<br />
* Governmental Theory - the relation is unclear<br />
* Communal substitution - the relation is unclear, but in opinion of [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton]] this looks like contradictory to his theory<br />
=== Related Bible verses ===<br />
"... through death he might bring to nothing him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and might deliver all of them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage." (Heb. 2:14-15).<br />
<br />
The power of death means that the beings subjected to fear of death were punished by the devil if they expressed altruism. Altruism was punished in the kingdom of the devil. The purpose of Christ's death was by resurrection to eliminate fear of death and so bring more heavenly beings to his side of the war. After Christ's resurrection the death is no more feared and the devil cannot rule anymore.<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=31Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T18:03:48Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Relation with other theories */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article<ref name=":0" />, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
=== Relation with other theories ===<br />
See a list of theological theories in <ref name=":0" />.<br />
* Ransom - the relation is unclear<br />
* Christus Victor - Victor Porton's theory is a special case of this theory<br />
* Moral exemplar - Victor Porton's theory is similar to this but the "exemplar" being for heavenly being rather then people<br />
* Satisfaction - the relation is unclear<br />
* Penal substitution - the relation is unclear<br />
TODO<br />
<br />
=== Related Bible verses ===<br />
"... through death he might bring to nothing him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and might deliver all of them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage." (Heb. 2:14-15).<br />
<br />
The power of death means that the beings subjected to fear of death were punished by the devil if they expressed altruism. Altruism was punished in the kingdom of the devil. The purpose of Christ's death was by resurrection to eliminate fear of death and so bring more heavenly beings to his side of the war. After Christ's resurrection the death is no more feared and the devil cannot rule anymore.<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=30Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T17:48:41Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Relation with other theories */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article<ref name=":0" />, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
=== Relation with other theories ===<br />
See a list of theological theories in <ref name=":0" />.<br />
* Ransom - the relation is unclear<br />
* Christus Victor - Victor Porton's theory is a special case of this theory<br />
* Moral exemplar - Victor Porton's theory is similar to this but the "exemplar" being for heavenly being rather then people<br />
* Satisfaction - the relation is unclear<br />
TODO<br />
<br />
=== Related Bible verses ===<br />
"... through death he might bring to nothing him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and might deliver all of them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage." (Heb. 2:14-15).<br />
<br />
The power of death means that the beings subjected to fear of death were punished by the devil if they expressed altruism. Altruism was punished in the kingdom of the devil. The purpose of Christ's death was by resurrection to eliminate fear of death and so bring more heavenly beings to his side of the war. After Christ's resurrection the death is no more feared and the devil cannot rule anymore.<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=29Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T17:43:10Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Relation with other theories */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article<ref name=":0" />, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
=== Relation with other theories ===<br />
See a list of theological theories in <ref name=":0" />.<br />
* Ransom - the relation is unclear<br />
* Christus Victor - Victor Porton's theory is a special case of this theory<br />
* Moral exemplar - Victor Porton's theory is similar to this but the "exemplar" being for heavenly being rather then people<br />
TODO<br />
<br />
=== Related Bible verses ===<br />
"... through death he might bring to nothing him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and might deliver all of them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage." (Heb. 2:14-15).<br />
<br />
The power of death means that the beings subjected to fear of death were punished by the devil if they expressed altruism. Altruism was punished in the kingdom of the devil. The purpose of Christ's death was by resurrection to eliminate fear of death and so bring more heavenly beings to his side of the war. After Christ's resurrection the death is no more feared and the devil cannot rule anymore.<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=28Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T17:36:51Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Relation with other theories */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article<ref name=":0" />, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
=== Relation with other theories ===<br />
See a list of theological theories in <ref name=":0" />.<br />
* Ransom - the relation is unclear<br />
* Christus Victor - Victor Porton's theory is a special case of this theory<br />
TODO<br />
<br />
=== Related Bible verses ===<br />
"... through death he might bring to nothing him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and might deliver all of them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage." (Heb. 2:14-15).<br />
<br />
The power of death means that the beings subjected to fear of death were punished by the devil if they expressed altruism. Altruism was punished in the kingdom of the devil. The purpose of Christ's death was by resurrection to eliminate fear of death and so bring more heavenly beings to his side of the war. After Christ's resurrection the death is no more feared and the devil cannot rule anymore.<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=27Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T16:09:36Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Relation with other theories */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article<ref name=":0" />, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
=== Relation with other theories ===<br />
See a list of theological theories in <ref name=":0" />.<br />
<br />
TODO<br />
<br />
=== Related Bible verses ===<br />
"... through death he might bring to nothing him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and might deliver all of them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage." (Heb. 2:14-15).<br />
<br />
The power of death means that the beings subjected to fear of death were punished by the devil if they expressed altruism. Altruism was punished in the kingdom of the devil. The purpose of Christ's death was by resurrection to eliminate fear of death and so bring more heavenly beings to his side of the war. After Christ's resurrection the death is no more feared and the devil cannot rule anymore.<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=26Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T15:23:45Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Fitting with "biblical" criteria */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article<ref name=":0" />, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
=== Relation with other theories ===<br />
See a list of theological theories in <ref name=":0" />.<br />
<br />
TODO<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=25Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T14:44:52Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article<ref name=":0" />, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=24Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T14:44:21Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
== [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory ==<br />
<br />
===[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation===<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
=== Further thoughts ===<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
=== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ===<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=23Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T14:41:22Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Fitting with "biblical" criteria */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
== Further thoughts ==<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ==<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death. Let's consider how they fit with [[User:Victor Porton|Victor Porton's]] theory:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=22Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T14:40:12Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
== Further thoughts ==<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ==<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<br />
==Bibliography==<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=21Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-08T14:39:54Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic<ref name=":0">[http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]</ref>. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
== Further thoughts ==<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.<br />
<br />
== Fitting with "biblical" criteria ==<br />
The paper<ref name=":0" /> lists "biblical reasons are non-negotiable for any biblical atonement theory" of Jesus' death:<br />
* to provide eternal life - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to reconcile us to God - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to express love - Victor Porton's theory is that Christ expresses "altruism" which is closely related to "love"<br />
* to defeat evil - fits exactly into Victor Porton's theory<br />
* to provide an example - yes, an example of altruism<br />
* to justify us apart from the Law - Victor Porton's theory does not address this issue but does not contradict it as well<br />
* to free us from sin to live righteously - Victor Porton assumes that freeing of sin is made possible by first defeating evil in the heaven, accordingly Victor Porton's theory<br />
* for our sins - If there were no sins, there would be no reason for Christ to die<br />
<references /></div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=20Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T23:11:16Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Further thoughts */ typo</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
== Further thoughts ==<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=19Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T23:04:15Z<p>Victor Porton: new idea</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.<br />
<br />
== Further thoughts ==<br />
Further thoughts are probably not as clear as the original idea, but need to be considered.<br />
<br />
If Christ didn't die, to prove that altruism wins, it would be necessary to eliminate all sinners (that is us), because while there is at least one sinner, he is a a fly in the ointment. So he has died instead of us.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=User:Victor_Porton&diff=18User:Victor Porton2016-06-07T22:02:41Z<p>Victor Porton: link updated</p>
<hr />
<div>Victor Porton is the creator of this site.<br />
<br />
*[http://endofgospel.org End of Gospel] (book)<br />
*[http://books.portonvictor.org/nt-commentary-online/ New Testament Commentary by a Mathematician] (book)<br />
*[http://books.portonvictor.org/repent/ How to repent of sins] (interactive webpage)<br />
*[http://portonvictor.org Homepage]</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Main_Page&diff=17Main Page2016-06-07T21:52:14Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>==Purpose of this site==<br />
<br />
This site is a wiki where we want to collect '''all''' interpretations and translations of New Testament.<br />
<br />
Please [[Special:UserLogin|signup]] and edit this site. You can put any kinds of commentaries on New Testament at this site, provided only that you don't violate copyright laws. Your edits will be moderated to protect from spam.<br />
<br />
==Biblical topics==<br />
<br />
Read and write any commentaries on New Testament topics:<br />
<br />
* [[Purpose_of_Jesus'_death|Purpose of Jesus' death]]<br />
<br />
==Rules==<br />
<br />
Rules for the site are not yet written. Please write rules proposal and discuss rules. Specifically we need to decide whether only "conventional" Christian views are allowed on this site, or will we allow all kinds of opinions.<br />
<br />
==Useful internal links==<br />
<br />
* [[Books|Books about New Testament]]<br />
<br />
==External links==<br />
<br />
* [https://withoutvowels.org Wiki site for Old Testament study]</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=16Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T21:03:32Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection of Jesus himself, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=15Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T21:03:02Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Victor Porton's explanation */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death. Even if you die, God will resurrect you." without the need of death and resurrection, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=14Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T20:59:37Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Victor Porton's explanation */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death." without the need of death and resurrection, but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=13Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T20:59:14Z<p>Victor Porton: /* Victor Porton's explanation */</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Unlike irrational human which may believe without a confirmation, rational heavenly beings in question need to see to believe. If only people's beliefs were in question, for Christ it would be enough to say "Believe me: Altruism leads to life, even at times it seems that it leads to death.", but this would be enough only for people not for heavenly beings.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=12Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T20:46:13Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks an explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Main_Page&diff=11Main Page2016-06-07T20:18:12Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>==Purpose of this site==<br />
<br />
This site is a wiki where we want to collect '''all''' interpretations and translations of New Testament.<br />
<br />
Please [[Special:UserLogin|signup]] and edit this site. You can put any kinds of commentaries on New Testament at this site, provided only that you don't violate copyright laws.<br />
<br />
==Biblical topics==<br />
<br />
Read and write any commentaries on New Testament topics:<br />
<br />
* [[Purpose_of_Jesus'_death|Purpose of Jesus' death]]<br />
<br />
==Rules==<br />
<br />
Rules for the site are not yet written. Please write rules proposal and discuss rules. Specifically we need to decide whether only "conventional" Christian views are allowed on this site, or will we allow all kinds of opinions.<br />
<br />
==Useful internal links==<br />
<br />
* [[Books|Books about New Testament]]<br />
<br />
==External links==<br />
<br />
* [https://withoutvowels.org Wiki site for Old Testament study]</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Books&diff=10Books2016-06-07T20:17:29Z<p>Victor Porton: Created page with "Feel free to add any books related to New Testament to this list: ==Misc New Testament topics== * [http://books.portonvictor.org/nt-commentary-online/ New Testament Commenta..."</p>
<hr />
<div>Feel free to add any books related to New Testament to this list:<br />
<br />
==Misc New Testament topics==<br />
<br />
* [http://books.portonvictor.org/nt-commentary-online/ New Testament Commentary by a Mathematician]. [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton]] (free) - misc New Testament notes with many new revelations.<br />
* [http://books.portonvictor.org/end-of-gospel/ End of Gospel]. [[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton]] - stop following New Testament commandments like a law, but switch to a new stage where we are not slaves anymore but friends of Christ.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=User:Victor_Porton&diff=9User:Victor Porton2016-06-07T20:13:51Z<p>Victor Porton: Created page with "Victor Porton is the creator of this site. *[http://endofgospel.org End of Gospel] (book) *[http://books.portonvictor.org/nt-commentary/ New Testament Commentary by a Mathema..."</p>
<hr />
<div>Victor Porton is the creator of this site.<br />
<br />
*[http://endofgospel.org End of Gospel] (book)<br />
*[http://books.portonvictor.org/nt-commentary/ New Testament Commentary by a Mathematician] (book)<br />
*[http://books.portonvictor.org/repent/ How to repent of sins] (interactive webpage)<br />
*[http://portonvictor.org Homepage]</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Main_Page&diff=8Main Page2016-06-07T17:48:47Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>==Purpose of this site==<br />
<br />
This site is a wiki where we want to collect '''all''' interpretations and translations of New Testament.<br />
<br />
Please [[Special:UserLogin|signup]] and edit this site. You can put any kinds of commentaries on New Testament at this site, provided only that you don't violate copyright laws.<br />
<br />
==Biblical topics==<br />
<br />
Read and write any commentaries on New Testament topics:<br />
<br />
* [[Purpose_of_Jesus'_death|Purpose of Jesus' death]]<br />
<br />
==Rules==<br />
<br />
Rules for the site are not yet written. Please write rules proposal and discuss rules. Specifically we need to decide whether only "conventional" Christian views are allowed on this site, or will we allow all kinds of opinions.<br />
<br />
==External links==<br />
<br />
* [https://withoutvowels.org Wiki site for Old Testament study]</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=7Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T17:45:07Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks and explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
This way Christ pulled many heavenly being to his side of the war and won the war.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Main_Page&diff=6Main Page2016-06-07T17:34:07Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>==Purpose of this site==<br />
<br />
This site is a wiki where we want to collect '''all''' interpretations and translations of New Testament.<br />
<br />
Please [[Special:UserLogin|signup]] and edit this site. You can put any kinds of commentaries on New Testament at this site, provided only that you don't violate copyright laws.<br />
<br />
==Biblical topics==<br />
<br />
Read and write any commentaries on New Testament topics:<br />
<br />
* [[Purpose_of_Jesus'_death|Purpose of Jesus' death]]<br />
<br />
==Rules==<br />
<br />
Rules for the site are not yet written. Please write rules proposal and discuss rules. Specifically we need to decide whether only orthodox Christian views are allowed on this site, or will we allow all kinds of opinions.<br />
<br />
==External links==<br />
<br />
* [https://withoutvowels.org Wiki site for Old Testament study]</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=5Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T17:32:47Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks and explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]):<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Purpose_of_Jesus%27_death&diff=4Purpose of Jesus' death2016-06-07T17:32:05Z<p>Victor Porton: Created page with "This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus. There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was puni..."</p>
<hr />
<div>This page asks why God has allowed to kill Jesus.<br />
<br />
There are many answers to this question, but most of them have certain deficiencies. For example: the answer "Jesus was punished for our sins instead of us, so that God could satisfy His wrath, so there are no more reason to punish us." has the following deficiency: It lacks and explanation why God needs to punish somebody, why God considers OK to punish Jesus instead of us; moreover this looks as an urgent injustice to punish not that person which sinned.<br />
<br />
Having believing Bible that God allowed Jesus to die instead of us, we nevertheless need to construct an explanation which fits our minds and does not look like a contradiction.<br />
<br />
There is a good article on this topic: [http://restitutio.org/2016/04/17/why-did-jesus-die-paper-for-2016-theological-conference/ Why Did Jesus Die? (Paper for 2016 Theological Conference)]. This article explains various existing explanations of Jesus' death, giving pro and contras for various explanations.<br />
<br />
==[[User:Victor_Porton|Victor Porton's]] explanation==<br />
<br />
While reading this article, [[User:Victor_Porton|I]] came up with an idea (first [https://endofgospel.wordpress.com/2016/05/11/did-christ-died-to-demonstrate-that-altruism-wins/ published in my blog]:<br />
<br />
Christ’s death was to demonstrate that an altruistic person will be rewarded (as in Christ’s resurrection and power over the entire heavens given) justly, even when at first it seems that this way leads to death.<br />
<br />
This has shown to the heavenly powers that altruism works and leads to life rather than to death as someone may expect.<br />
<br />
And this needs a sacrifice of God himself, because it is necessary to show that even the highest level of altruism is rewarded.<br />
<br />
Please discuss this my idea further, especially how it fits with different Bible verses.</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Main_Page&diff=3Main Page2016-06-07T17:21:11Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>==Purpose of this site==<br />
<br />
This site is a wiki where we want to collect '''all''' interpretations and translations of New Testament.<br />
<br />
Please [[Special:UserLogin|signup]] and edit this site. You can put any kinds of commentaries on New Testament at this site, provided only that you don't violate copyright laws.<br />
<br />
==Rules==<br />
<br />
Rules for the site are not yet written. Please write rules proposal and discuss rules. Specifically we need to decide whether only orthodox Christian views are allowed on this site, or will we allow all kinds of opinions.<br />
<br />
==External links==<br />
<br />
* [https://withoutvowels.org Wiki site for Old Testament study]</div>Victor Portonhttps://nt.withoutvowels.org/w/index.php?title=Main_Page&diff=2Main Page2016-06-07T17:20:31Z<p>Victor Porton: </p>
<hr />
<div>==Purpose of this site==<br />
<br />
This site is a wiki where we want to collect '''all''' interpretations and translations of New Testament.<br />
<br />
Please [[Special:UserLogin|signup]] and edit this site. You can put any kinds of commentaries on New Testament at this site, provided only that you don't violate copyright laws.<br />
<br />
==Rules==<br />
<br />
Rules for the site are not yet written. Please write rules proposal and discuss rules. Specifically we need to decide whether only orthodox Christian views are allowed on this site, or will we allow all kinds of opinions.<br />
<br />
==External links==<br />
<br />
* [https://withoutvowels.org Site for Old Testament study]</div>Victor Porton